Jocelyn Chong interviews Melisa Keenan about the new Interview Series.

These conversations needs to be happening

INTERVIEW TRANSCRIPTION

Jocelyn Chong 00:01

Welcome, everyone to this amazing beautiful conversation that Melisa Keenan and I are going to talk about in her series that she is very passionate about at the moment. She is running a seven series on the Chronicles of the High-Powered CEO, and a queen on the throne. So, let's just pause and imagine a queen on the throne. What is the image that comes to your mind, if you are listening to that? I would always think that wow, someone powerful, someone who is really, really mature, carrying such grace, carrying such beauty, carrying such love, and kindness for people. And that's what Melissa is.

Melissa has got such gentle but strong and powerful energy that she exudes, and that she has got this passion and calling for such a time as this, to really introduce this topic to women who are necessary to hear this powerful message. I call it necessary because it is a time that we need to tune in. And so I'm inviting her to talk more about this passion of hers. And, Melissa, tell us what inspired you so much to champion this powerful topic in your business.

Melisa Keenan 01:36

Thank you so much, Jocelyn, for this opportunity. You know, when I started my business, it's been about four and a half years now. I knew that I was going to face a lot of challenges. But I really thought I had done enough inner work between therapy and programs and all kinds of personal development that the mental battle actually wasn't going to be an issue. It's like, okay, I need to learn new strategies. And, I need to learn how to run a business. And I need to learn different things about putting myself out there. But I was like, I'm ready for the challenge. And the mental battle that I've experienced in running a business has shocked me.

And so for the first few years, I couldn't really understand why. It felt like I had backslid to almost trauma response. And it wasn't in my personal relationships anymore. It was in my business. And the more that I studied this and began working with other businesswomen, talking to them about intimacy, talking to them about their relationships, and their businesses would come up. And it was like, wait a minute, there are common themes here. So in 2021, I shifted my model to working almost exclusively with businesswomen, and really identifying these patterns and doing lots of market research to understand what shows up for businesswomen, when it comes to you know, how do our relationships and our business correlate with each other, right?

I spent all of 2021, deep in that research and really trying to understand the patterns that I was seeing. And what I recognize is the more success that a woman had generated, the more pressure that she was under. And I found that this is exclusive to women, not to men That there were certain pressures and kind of boxes that women were sort of being pushed into, that were different than men were being pushed into. And that also even if they're the same as the ones men are being pushed into they, women don't respond the same. And I began to realize that the mental battle I had been experiencing was actually part of a larger climate that was happening, just one more of those voices pulling women down.

So, the more I studied that the more respect I started to gain for those who had persevered and actually generated massive success. I think that probably throughout my 20s I thought that wealth and success came almost like luck. Like you were in the right place at the right time with the right product and it just all happened for you. And obviously, anybody who actually starts building a business and gets into the nuts and bolts knows that there's actually no such thing as an overnight millionaire or overnight success. Anybody who's had that overnight success probably has like nine failed businesses before it or whatever.

There's so much that goes into building a business. I recognize these women who have actually created 7+ figures in their business are my heroes because they started out with a strong why. And they were willing to do whatever it took to get that mission and message out in the world to make the impact that they feel called to make. And I was like, I need to, I want to do whatever it takes to support these women. Because on the same token, these women are also have been the most hurt, sometimes the most jaded, because people have stabbed them in the back, you know, like throw food at them because of their success, rather than patting them on the back, and blowing them up and lifting them up and being excited for them.

And they struggle in dating, they struggle in relationships. Now, if they're making more money than their husband, that's a conversation. It just brings in so many challenges. And I thought, how many of these women are standing at the top of their empire feeling so completely alone, that's why I'm doing this interview series.

My intention it’s create an space for connection and community.

Jocelyn Chong 06:11

Yes, and I can tell you at some point in my life, I resonated with that as well, because, in many roles that I helped in the senior position in the leading banks in Australia, I generated over $25 million to about $35 million. And when I reached that point, my peers who are male counterparts, always felt very threatened. And to dumb, it is they've got a club, they've got a group. But I was alone because many times I'm the only female on that layer of leadership.

And so, I started to really change the way I behave, to fit into their world. Started to speak their language, rather than owning my own femininity, being who I am, and being comfortable in the way I carry myself, the way I speak, the way I hold myself. And Organizations sometimes also play a part in terms of trying to make females more male-like, because they will make comments like if you don't join the men, you're going to miss out. And so the female would start to dress more suits rather than colorful, amazing, vibrant colors, they would use less lipstick because they are the ones show up on the boardroom table having a conversation and they are wearing a striking red dress. And when they do that, they have to behave and probably put in 300% of their energy to raise their voice and be heard. And more often than not, what I noticed is that this female becomes more of the male energy and the last who they are, externally, it appears that they are female, they are doing the right thing by what is required by their role.

But internally, they are very, very, very exhausted, tired, because they are not themselves. Because they are playing on a different level of energy. And that over time, because they suppress those emotions, that female listen to intuition, that female listen to their body, that female engages themselves so differently. They completely then become just a functioning individual that carries the amazing title, have a fat bank account, but so disliked by the people around them. I've seen that I hear that. I taste that in the environment at work across three major banks that I work with. And those females then found it really hard to pull in their own tribe, because there was a lack of support.

So what you're doing is just so ideal for such a time as this. Because a lot of corporate women that I come across, doesn't have the container that enables them to share openly, safely in a judgment-free environment. They can just pour themselves out. And engage their own individual soul

Melisa Keenan 09:37

Who can blame them? Right. That's the thing that I think. Much of the world wants to point the finger at the bitchy CEO, or say how intimidating she is. The world wants to point the finger at her. But I think on the inside she's thinking "What other choices Did I have?" either be disempowered and not pursue a career and not actually find out how capable I am, or, having to make some sacrifices, having to make some compromises or, don't do any of those things, don't create the success or find out how capable I am, or go and be, show that I actually can do it even better, right? So who can blame her?

And I think that's a huge part of why I wanted to create this interview series is because so many are blaming her pointing the finger at her. And what my intention is, is that this is a space of people saying, me too, of people saying we're not here to blame you. And also, there's hope. If you're feeling that disconnect, like you, 're talking about Jocelyn, that space where it's like, I'm exhausted, and all I can possibly do is drink wine on my couch on the weekends, because I gave 7,000%, five days a week in my job, what we would say is, maybe there is a better way, and maybe there is a balance that can be found. And right now, like you keep saying such a time as this, there is no better time because we have the great resignation right now, we have people asking themselves: is this who I want to be? Is this how I want to show up? Employee retention is at an all-time low because they can make their own choices. And you're a perfect example of that, leaving the corporate world and saying, I'm just going to start my own business where I can be fully self-expressed, however, I want to be. And not to say that that's the only option. But I just think these conversations need to be happening.

This is an everyday topic that we need to introduce this year so that more and more females are aware that there is a place, space, and container that they can start to open up

Jocelyn Chong 11:58

And starting the conversation is just going to keep the channel open for others to even entertain that. So what I realize also is that a lot of females have those thoughts running in their heads. And they may ignore them because they are so consumed with what is in front of them. And so as we allow this channel to open up more and more and create and demonstrate a role model, a safe environment, for them to gradually speak, we are going to really attract all these women coming through and sharing their views and sharing in a way that is going to help the current and the future generation to bring in balance. Because ultimately we want to bring in balance because currently, the world is lopsided. I hate to point out, but I will, and out of pure love and genuine me, you know that kindness that I want to see balance is that there are so many conferences around the world. If you look at those keynote speakers, all of them are male.

All of them are male. When a female? Last year, I was invited to a virtual speaking engagement. And I thought to it, I'm not gonna attend because everyone in the picture was male. And they're trying to teach females how to run a business. How is that a balance? I attended a board room, master class last year. And in the Australian workplace, Gender Diversity is still quite a new act in Australia. And so we're trying to bring in science, technology, mathematics, and engineering, and bring in more women to those types of roles, and one of the leaders in one of the highest construction companies, and she held a very senior role there and she was so challenged by mail, telling her off, even though she was holding such a high post. And she said luckily her Chairman supported her view and that she was comfortable.

But when she shared that she was so anxious about the fact that she stood firm, responding to all the males who challenge her view, although she's more senior than implementing a new policy, to bring balance, to bring equity, to bring inclusion into that industry. So this is a topic that we need to talk about more and more. We need to bring it out to the forefront of board agendas, of board meetings, of any type of events, and make it like a normal topic that we need to talk about because It is not a topic for International Women's Day, is not a topic for October where you have got breast cancer month or cancer month for, you know, a particular area that we champion and we support or we create funding for.

This is an everyday topic that we need to introduce this year so that more and more females are aware that there is a place, space, and container that they can start to open up. Another example that had was in 2020, into an International Women's Day event, I spoke to about 85 people in the audience. And it was a topic of how so many women in Australia are underearning. So in Australia, the ratio is almost 20% or so, lower than males. And no matter how hard you work, and you fight for it because the pay scale is captured that way, is very, very little wiggle room plus, set a lot of the senior positions that sign off, those are male. And so they always see females as: this one is going to go for maternity leave. So why should you consider her for the next promotion? Or you know what, when she comes back, she will do an admin role because she has to pick up her kids. Or if she's in a senior position, will she have the confidence to voice her opinion? Can I trust her when I send her out for future assignments? Or if she needs to travel interstate, she's got kids at home. So who's gonna look after her kids?

All those things that males talk about that they are never challenged off. They have kids to the other ones producing those kids together with a female. So it's a 50/50. And those comments or statements are never never brought up for males who take up those assignments. And so adding to those areas that we want to blend in with, you know, engaging our intuition, having a very good healthy sex and intimate life, making sure that we look after ourselves and not just think about a force and push and pull way of working. But really working together with the way we have energetics around a business.

So, I would love to hear from you. When are the next few series coming up? I know that you've done quite a few series already. And you've interviewed some amazing women around the globe. And when are the next few coming up? And where can all these female leaders connect with you as well so that they can watch those interviews that you've conducted before and come on a journey with you?

Melisa Keenan 17:52

Yes, so if you come to my website, www.melisakeenan.com, the first thing that will pop up is the pop-up for the chronicles of the high-powered female CEO. And that will allow you to get all the emails, every single time I do one of these interviews, an email will go out. And it will also allow you into the bank, the database where all the interviews are held.

So if you miss one, you can come back and see the interviews that have already been done. And it's my intention that this creates like I said, connection and community. And so we also intend to host a retreat towards October, the dates and details haven't been set in stone yet. But a space where those who have listened and those who have participated in the interviews can come and gather and what we know about it is that oh be super high luxury and amazing. And like a major judgment-free zone. Because you know, one of the things we haven't really said, the unfortunate truth is a lot of time the pressure comes from other women. And so creating a space where women can come together and just be understood and drop the competition and judgy and, insecurities and just see each other and then collaborate and network and stuff. I mean, how powerful will that be?

So the website, that's where you can find all the information about it. And I'd love to share actually I have a little commercial that we made for the interview series. Can I share that?

Jocelyn Chong 19:40

Absolutely. Go ahead.

Thank you so much for that. And I hope that all of you enjoyed this beautiful conversation with Melissa. She's amazing. She also has got a wonderful Facebook group that you can join for free, so feel free to jump in and see you next time.

Melisa Keenan 21:14

Thanks so much. Bye, guys.